Lemmy.ml has now blocked threads.net / Meta

YOUR MOVE LEMMY.WORLD

Seriously, I don't want to have to pull up the tent stakes already.
- I just got to Lemmy.world a few days ago.
  
  Out of the reddit frying pan and into the Meta fire?
  
  NO!
  
  lemmy.world, stop cowering and start respect your users: announce your intentions clearly now.
- Permanently Deleted
- You should anyway to spread the load.
- I would like to put my 2c here. Fediverse, defederated and self-hostable platforms give you the opportunity to not be closed within a walled garden. I would say that people on the fediverse should be more flexible and be ready to change an instance, or self-host themselves if that is their thing, in case something goes wrong. You must remember that it is you now who decides where to build the tent. I think of it as a summer camping holiday: You go to a camp, stay there for a few days, but when it starts to rain in the area, becomes boring, or a group of noisy campers comes in, you relocate to another camp, if you cannot do anything about the problem in your current camp.
  
  So, I would say you as a fediverse user should be prepared to rebuild your tent repeatedly, even if you stay on a single instance for a long time.
error loading comment

Every time I see a picture of him I think it has to be edited or something. He’s like a walking Snapchat filter.

"Hello, fellow humans!"
- Does any other human out there love smoked meats ?
  
  Context for those out of the loop
- Believe it or not, but this image is also not edited
That one definitely is edited lol. Reminds me of the android from that Queen album cover
- I can't unsee it now lmao
- Now I get why Stewie was terrified.
- Good god that's terrifying.
- How
He always looks AI-generated
- That's because he's an AI.
He likely has a skilled pr team that has crafted his image as unique, brilliant, and even all this alien/ lizard stuff. In general, he is simply a billionaire and for sure not have much in common with working people.
- the lizard thing is unfortunately just antisemitism, and older than zucc himself. the whole alien lizard people running the world bit comes from David Icke, who is very much a fascist, and was inspired directly by old school Nazi conspiracy theory texts like the Protocols of the Elders of Zion.
- HELLO, FELLOW HUMANS
It looks like his face was stretched vertically at the middle of his nose, and someone blurred his undereye area and blended the bottoms of his eyeballs in. Disturbing stuff.
When you nut but she still Zucc-in

I would like to also add this argument into the discussion, since I've seen a lot of people who are voting for federating with meta, with the argument that defederating just because we don't like someone goes against the idea of Fediverse, and interconnected network of diverse servers that is should inclusive and allows people to connect.

It's quite the contrary - allowing Meta in goes directly against the idea of Fediverse, and we should fight it as much as possible.

This is a literal quote from the main header on https://www.fediverse.to/

The fediverse is a collection of community-owned, ad-free, decentralised, and privacy-centric social networks.

Each fediverse instance is managed by a human admin. You can find fediverse instances dedicated to art, music, technology, culture, or politics.

Join the growing community and experience the web as it was meant to be.

Judging by this main selling point of the Fediverse, it sounds to me like Meta shouldn't be in the Fediverse do begin with, and every instance should defederate from them by default.

100% I will only be using instances that don't federate with corporations.
Isn’t the Fediverse an idea? If so, that’s just someone’s opinion of the Fediverse. Activity Pub is the technology. Not saying it’s wrong, just adding context.
Centralisation will always set in due to sheer complacency. I mean it has already happened. The main player in the reddit-like fediverse is lemmy.world
No other instance comes close to the size of lemmy.world
I also disagree with Metas method of tracking and monetising every last bit of data (I'm trying to get rid of their platforms myself) but to expect the fediverse to be a balanced mixture of access points is just daydreaming.
- I don't expect it to be balanced. I also don't mind that a lot of users are centralized at lemmy.world - because we know the admins, and there isn't a largescale corporation behind them that would be capable of monetizing and manipulating their userbase. The only kind of balance I want is that there isn't an instance with multi-billion funding and teams of engineers dedicated to squeezing their userbase and monetizing every character they type. Sure, it will inevitably happen that someone from an instance would try something like this, but that's an acceptable risk with community-run stuff and may or may not happen - and it probably won't be as succesfull or large-scale. However, if you let in someone you are certain will do something like that, and has unimaginable amount of resources and manpower to do it, then they will just squeeze it dry while not shying away from exploiting every single privacy mistake there is in the protocol or our implementation.

Thanks for saving us lemmy.ml Admins.

o7. We're out here for yall, and we're gonna make sure the fediverse stays inoculated from threats.
- I'm happy to call lemmy.ml my new home. BASED take!
- Why do I keep seeing a plague doctor mask for your pfp

Thank you Lemmy.ml Meta can F off.

They really put the meta in metastasize!
- This is brilliant!
All the way off!
Lemmy developers, thank you!

I hope Lemmy.world does the same.

I'm moving if they don't.
- Same. I just wish there was an easy way to transfer. I just found the communities I wanted and I don’t look forward to making a new profile and adding them all again.
Permanently Deleted
- I’m thinking the same thing…they’re trying to avoid blowback by breaking the fedipact by just….saying nothing.
  
  I swear I’ll fucking leave if they don’t dederate with Meta
- I am on lemmy.world, but the inaction of the admins there made me create an account here on .ml as soon as I saw one of the admins being basically as "naive" as Mastodon's Rochko.
- Mastodon.world said they won't pre-emptively defederate (but are prepared to do so as soon as they notice something bad), so I'm guessing lemmy.world has the same stance
- I posed this question to the admins a while back. How does the community officially suggest instances to defederate. How do we vote on those choices? Where is the process?
  
  This was during the lemmy.online thing, where that instance (which no longer exists) created a bot to basic just crawl reddit and duplicate posts to their instance. I immediately told the instance admin that they should stop and I asked the admins where the process was to submit a de-federation request.
  
  All I got was a bunch of BS from users about how de-federation should be something we don't take lightly, blah blah blah, but all I was asking was where the process is. How are we even partaking in a system that's so ripe for admin abuse?
  
  The lemmy.world admins aren't malicious... they're just in over their heads. They've struggled with the technical side of running the service and they haven't built out some of the social tools that an instance this side needs. Hopefully they mature quickly.
I hope Leemy.world does the same *soon

I would say we need a vote if lemmy.world should do the same. I would be for blocking meta.

+1
X2
I wonder how qualified the average Lemmy user is to participate in this sort of decision. This call to defederate feels a lot like Brexit. Maybe I'm just projecting my own ignorance, but I doubt 1 in 50 people have a more informed opinion than "meta bad".
- Permanently Deleted
Well, why don't we have a Lemmy feature where the individual user can block content and users from an instance? Rather than defederating completely?

People left reddit because of corporate f*ckery, and some of them are now making excuses for meta?? What kind of mental gymnastics is this?

A lot of people left Reddit because it was a drowning ship. They didn't flock to the fediverse because of what it stands for, and they'll happily bounce over to the next popular corporate run data farm at their earliest convenience.
- I agree with your sentiment, however I don't think Reddit is a sinking ship. It sucks, me and many other people are angry with them, some of us left but it's not nearly enough to make them actually sink. Reddit is too recognizable a brand.
  They're too big to fail.
- Good riddance if they want that over this.
- Unfortunately, you're not incorrect. They're just sheeple.
- This - I don’t care much about “corporate fuckery” in this context. The reason I left Reddit is that losing Apollo was sufficiently painful to prompt me to try something else. Honestly the pervasive anti-capitalist and FOSS-worshiping sentiments here are kind of off-putting.
It's just a typical day on the internet, honestly.
Typical redditor moment tbh
It's what is known as dipshittery, and many people suffer from it.

So... you're not gonna try Threads then???

the lemmy.ml admin team took about 2 minutes to decide to preemptively block threats / Meta

The only sane approach to this "dilemma". Thank you for keeping the instance free of "threats" (I see what you did there)

It's quite the dilemmy

Excellent. Big corporations go against the very idea of the fediverse.

Good riddance

...the lemmy.ml admin team took about 2 minutes to decide to pre-emptively block threats / Meta.

When the typo is more accurate than what was intended to be written.

Channeling Stallman and referring to the Windows 32 bit Application Programming Interface as lose32 instead of win32.

Amen! I made a longer post explaining my reasoning for blocking Threads and the decision took only 15 minutes.

Congrats on being based as well! I'm not on your server, but thanks for looking out for your users.

Thank you so much! Let's make sure the XMPP situation never repeats ever again.

Still using heavily encrypted, self-hosted XMPP to talk to my family without META.

Even if they somehow manage to drag the majority of users over to their platform, we'll still have our little free haven.
- Yea most people who will use threads probably wouldn’t use other Fediverse things or even know what they are. And people who are already here hate Meta anyway

Prophylactic intervention is the best defense against Metastasis.

Well done Lemmy.ml - hopefully the rest of the fediverse follows your example. This is, no exaggeration, an existential threat to the fed.

The fediverse taking off is an existential threat to Meta. I have no doubt that they will take any actions they consider necessary to maintain control over most users.

Good riddance to Meta's bullshit. Stop them before they get to the first E in EEE.

Here's a sign to put up at the border between Lemmy.ml and Threads, which will surely have a 100-meter wall built on it with 50 kV electric fences, barbed wire, watchtowers, snipers, and whatever to keep those Meta corporate fuckers out.

Threads Quarantine Zone sign

Thank you for your integrity and ethics. This action sends a strong message to the capitalist leeches where we stand.

Gonna go against the grain here a little bit, but why? If they are federated, it will mean that you can move off of threads more easily to other servers and not get locked into a walled garden. Encouraging companies to embrace federation will avoid the shit shows like we've seen at twitter and reddit, since users will be easily able to jump ship without much loss. Additionally, apps like threads make federated platforms much more approachable to newcomers and those who do not even know what the fediverse is.

I'd love someone to explain it to me, but this feels like a massive footgun.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace,_extend,_and_extinguish

Embrace: they embrace the fediverse, bring millions of new users to it and everyone is happy. The fediverse grows and the new meta instance gets a ton of content. Everyone is happy

Extend: meta begins to add features to their instance which clashes with or is unusable with other instances. These begin to pile up and issues develop.

Extinguish: meta unfederates from other instances. People are now forced to stay where they were and lose a majority of their friends and content from metas instance. Or switch over. Mass migration away from original instances. These instances die
- https://ploum.net/2023-06-23-how-to-kill-decentralised-networks.html
- How is that different from defederating now?
  
  In the Embrace, Extend, Extinguish scenario, assuming they get to "Extinguish", the rest of the Fediverse becomes isolated and cannot connect with their friends and content.
  
  If we defederate now, the Fediverse becomes isolated and cannot connect with Threads content, and cannot connect with friends who choose to be on Threads instead of a disconnected alternative.
I mean, lemmy.ml explicitly describes itself as a community of privacy and FOSS enthusiasts (and I'm reasonably certain it's run by actual communists) so I'd have been quite surprised if they'd embraced Meta tbh.
one problem it that it has threads has a very large userbase and it will likely flood the fediverse so instances that dont block them may dont really have other content and from what i understand is that the content there is flooded with influencers. At least the type of influencers i think are annoying and too comercialised.

And with the flood of content server admins that only do it for fun will get a problem with moderation.

There was a dude in this comment section that left a link about some type of essay (the link contains something with 15 minutes).

Edit: https://sopuli.xyz/comment/879382
You realize that accepting meta/threads terms you give them permission to sell your data right? They will sell it to advertisers. They help the fbi and others track your every step. Also on fediverse you info is stored locally if the server goes down you don’t have to worry about your info being accessed remotely. I think I saw something where they said that lemmy and kbin store your data for three days then it gets auto deleted. If I was a large instance I would block meta also. Everything meta touched dies!
- I got this step, defederating essentially says to them that I dont consent to them getting my data.
  
  But I'm really missing something here, since any instance that zucc controls that is federated to the large instances just exposes my data to zucc.
  
  Defederating is one step, the instance owners have taken that step now, so far so good, well then zucc will just create a lemmy/kbin instance that they own, they join the fed and not even announce meta's affiliation with it, my data is still zucc'ed.
I agree with you. I think this is a way to introduce people who aren’t tech-savvy into Activity Pub and Fediverse, which is ultimately a good thing.

Yes, Meta has a history of being untrustworthy, but I think a place that allows communication between a large population isn’t a bad thing either.

I would rather wait and see when Threads is full federated and what that means. We just don’t have enough information to make a decision.

I would rather 70 million people have joined Mastodon but that’s just not how things work and we need to be realistic.
Exactly what I'm thinking. Also why are server admins choosing what I can do on other instances? Am I missing something here? Why can't users be in control of who they interact with?
- They are "blocking" threads only from their instance. Other instances can do what their admin prefer. If you are unhappy, you have to migrate to another instance closer to your tastes or host your instance (this is how fediverse is designed)
- Yeah this is the point that irks me, each individual should get to decide for themselves, I totally get and respect the arguments for not engaging with Threads, but I don't want that decision made for me. And unfortunately it seems like most fediverse admins feel the same way, so "just switch instances" isn't necessarily practical
I'll never make a threads account, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't want to interact with anyone from threads. That's the beauty of the fediversve: I can still talk to metas users without sacrificing my first born to the zucc.
- NO....the beauty of the Fediverse is that corporate interests aren't welcome here. It's a new frontier and you're advocating that we extend an invite to the ones that fucked up the last frontier. Make a threads account if that's important, you have ZERO argument for the rest of us to need the ability to connect with them from a platform specifically designed for decentralized control.
- I think this is kind of the central problem.
  
  Embrace:
  
  Adopt the ActivityPub protocol and make an instance, awesome!
  
  Extend:
  
  Bring their massive userbase and content to the fediverse, what the heck, beyond awesome!
  
  Extinguish:
  
  Gradually make changes to degrade the experience of people in the fediverse using other instances, to "gently" guide them into signing up to threads, until eventually block off the rest of the fediverse entirely, oh no.
I agree, threads connecting to the fediverse seems like it would be a positive step for everyone. I'm not sure how meta could kill the fediverse as long as independent servers exist. If meta is flooding the fediverse with spam or other influencer bs, then we can all just defederate.

I have an alternate theory that threads is never planning to support the fediverse. They are trying to attract users who are looking for a Twitter alternative, and right now the most compelling option is mastodon. But if threads announces activitypub support, then some would-be mastodon users might join threads instead, thinking it will all be connected. But if threads ends up winning all those users anyways, then they'll just say fuck it, we don't need activitypub.
- threads is never planning to support the fediverse
  
  Same thing I'm thinking. If they were going to support it, they would've done it already. And it wouldn't be an after thought.
- I agree, threads connecting to the fediverse seems like it would be a positive step for everyone.
  
  How did you even end up here?
So far I've only got a lot of unsatisfying answers (from a factual perspective). It seems to boil down to how much individuals on the fediverse fear Meta is in their capability of doing a full take-over. Personally, I feel like we're pretty protected form that. I've posted my questions, and still looking for some good answers here:

https://lemmy.world/post/1118810
- It's pretty damn simple actually. Let's say we fully federate with Threads, what will happen?
  
  Threads gets a massive amount of users, they already have 20 million sign-ups on the first day! Their user base will be gigantic
  
  We'll get a big influx of content (if Meta does the federation properly), huge communities will pop up on Threads and you'll join those communities. It's unlikely that Threads users will join communities hosted on smaller instances, why join a community with 1k users if Meta has one with 200k?
  
  Now Meta controls 99% of the users AND content. They can switch off federation at any moment. Maybe they cover it with "we have a new cool feature, but it breaks federation, sorry!" in that moment all our Lemmy instances lose most of their users and content. And you lose all your communities you joined
  
  Lemmy users will migrate to threads, because they want their content back, the fediverse dies (except for a few hundred to thousand hold-over nerds who won't give up)
  
  Fuck Meta.
- Damn, i can't believe how many people immediately jump to the astroturfing accusation instead of discussing the points you raised. I think we can all agree that meta is evil and we shouldn't trust them. The solution should be to build a network that's resilient to bad actors rather than thinking we can just block all the bad actors. As long as there are independent fediverse servers supported by their communities, it's hard to see how meta could totally take over the entire fediverse.
  
  My bigger concern is that meta could gain influence over the activitypub standard, but that's not a battle we can win by simply blocking meta servers.
I feel like Threads and Bluesky could lift the entire fediverse ocean, give it content and legitimacy and server capacity. And if the fediverse chooses to Balkanize and fracture in response, before we’ve even seen what effects they have on the community, then yeah we’re shooting ourselves in the foot.
- give it content and legitimacy and server capacity
  
  by concentrating said content and legitimacy within their walled garden servers. Then they perform the rug pull and shut the gates closed, they have all the content and we have nothing.

Hi guys, I'm new here from Reddit and I'm still learning about Lemmy and the Fediverse. Can someone ELI5 how not blocking Threads can negatively affect this community? Thanks.

This is the gist: https://ploum.net/2023-06-23-how-to-kill-decentralised-networks.html

Basically, big companies can destroy decentralised network from within once big enough people adopt it.

What they do is

Embrace - adopt the network with their own proprietary system, like Threads for example, as opposed to other system in the fediverse right now that are open source.

Extend - spend resources like money, manpower, and even extensive knowledge on how to expand and make the network a better place with a lot more features while simultaneously promoting and making so that only their proprietary app can access it in the best way.

Exterminate / Extinguish - once they have good amount of users, they can start crippling the other side, like maybe Threads can see posts from Lemmy and Mastodon but not the other way around, people are gonna think that Threads is superior and leaving the original instances. They can also pull back resources like even the people who used to work on developing the network that they used to give so generously before, and such the maintainer now has no way to keep up in developing the network.

Also known as the EEE tactic https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace,_extend,_and_extinguish
- Billy Gates tearing up with pride right now
- Doing it the amoeba way.
- Exterminate / Extinguish - once they have good amount of users, they can start crippling the other side
  
  That's users' fault. I don't want to disrespect anybody, that's not my intention, but if users are stupid enough to listen to the songs of the Sirens, that's not Sirens' fault, but users' fault.
  
  You say that defederating is the only way to prevent EEE. But defederating doesn't prevent people to move to Threads, doesn't prevent people to listen to the songs of the Sirens. It only prevents people to see the Sirens.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace,_extend,_and_extinguish

I think the idea is that by being the largest player they could take over and add features that the rest of the fediverse didn’t have. And then the people here (mastodon) would move there to keep following their favourite celeb.

I don’t think there’s any good argument why you couldn’t keep both for different things. Or why Facebook would even care about the ~200k users on mostodon when they cracked 70M in 24 hours
I think it's because Threads will be able to use content generated from unblocked instances.

Haha... I wasn't wrong when choosing lemmy.ml as my lemmy server 😉

Joined today. Feeling good about this decision. 🤘🏿
- Same here, we gotta put our activity where our beliefs exist.

The great part of federation is that users who want to use Threads still can, and instances who don't want to federate with Meta don't have to. People who want to double-dip can sign up for their favorite instance(s) of choice, as well as with Threads. Neither one has to have any app shut down and everyone still gets to make a choice as an end-user rather than be decided upon by an unmovable authority. Win win!

Great news, now let's hope every instance follows.

Joined a few Lemmy instances, but the admin team taking actions like these might make lemmy.ml my main place to go. Anything corporate is irredeemable.

Kudos...... It's very much appreciated and a refreshing change to not be let down by something you enjoy online.

I think a preemptive block on threads and meta is a wise move! I did it for both my Mastodon and Lemmy instances.

Thank you!

Meta will only go full on E/E/E on the fediverse, even by "accident" (like adding new features and breaking the standard). Better choke them off right from the start and build small organic communities instead.

Ok so they make new features on their threads platform. All of a sudden cross posting from lemmy to threads gets more difficult because they aren't respecting the standard.

Now what? Are all Lemmy users gonna flood over to Threads now? The vast majority don't even want to federated to Threads, let alone migrate their accounts.

I think this whole thing is overblown. EEE is a real thing but nobody has yet to provide a concrete mechanism that can come about from just federation with Threads.
- EEE is a real thing but nobody has yet to provide a concrete mechanism that can come about from just federation with Threads.
  
  It'd be similar to the approach used to kill XMPP.

Excellent news. I would have moved to another instance that did block if .ml didn't block them. Thank you for this lemmy.ml

Could you tell me where you got this view?
- https://lemmy.ml/instances

I hope beehaw does it too despite their status a pro-liberal instance.

Liberal/free market ideals are very well aligned with Fediverse/Lemmy: freedom to chose social media providers without being locked-in, free market of instances, free market of both front-end/backend software, freedom to run or fork the software myself...

Sure, I didn't get to chose this instance's policy, but a) I could find another or start my own if I disagreed (Not so different than electing representatives in a liberal democracy), and b) so far I don't disagree with this policy as Facebook is a threat to some basic software freedoms...

Personally I dislike all the -ism labels. Issues are complex with often contradictory stances. It's almost as though labels are used to divide people on otherwise common issues and common ground by oversimplifying policies into tribalism.
- Free market is exactly the cause of things such as meta. It's not about consumers having a choice, it's about enabling any scheme to get rich, so the choice is actually to companies to take the ability to choose from the consumers (the market is free, not the people). Thank god the whole point of the fediverse is to not be a market and not treat it's users as consumers Edit : actually fb and ig users aren't the real consumers, they are the product, and other companies who buy their personal data are the actual consumers, but anyway, this is irrelevant to the question, I just wanted to point out another reason to fight them. It's really difficult to escape the grasp of the GAFAM since they basically control the world nowadays (can't not use youtube), but thankfully the fediverse is here as a tool to help us escape meta and the likes, let's not let it be corrupted by capitalism
- Couldn't agree more with your last paragraph. That's why I've always hated all political parties. 90 percent of issues are as simple are supporting or being against something

Based

will lemmy.world do the same or will I have to delete me account there?

The smaller instances have no choice. The sheer amount of posts and comments there will overwhelm anything short of a server farm.

Just joined lemmy.ml after being on lemmy world. Until they decide on blocking meta I have no reason to be there.

Their devs have been having a hard time upgrading to the latest versions of lemmy as well, and as you probably know it's incredibly easy to sign up for an account on lemmy.world so the quality of comments and people is probably gonna be lower. I have an account on each instance, but yaknow it will take a while for everyone to figure out where they prefer to be.

Yes excellent! No corporations!!!

I spent a month getting an instance set up on .world, wearing my account in, putting up with the lag and other constant problems... then I read about this threads™ nonsense and how .world were playing a "wait and see" game with an evil empire. Read this thread (heh!), moved to .ml. Much smoother and more glitch-free experience. Just have to start over again. So far so good!

What's the difference between lemmy.world and Lemmy.ml? Completely different instances? Sorry I'm new and still don't understand everything
- Yes but you can access content from both of them from the other. Just browse to it or add the communities from the other to your subscriptions.
- Its like one is hotmail and the other is yahoo mail. They are free services/hosts that allow you to access the activityPub protocol. There are hundreds of such providers, and you can even host you own on your own services if you wanted to/were inclined.
  
  Lemmy is a specific layout of the ActivityPub protocol. Continuing the metaphor, you could think of Lemmy like an email newsgroup. All the different lemmy instances display and sort the newsgroups the same way, which is to emulate reddit.
- From what I can tell, .world is the main, biggest instance with the most people. That means whenever there are technical problems or waves of new signups, things tend to get a bit glitchy due to the system being overloaded. .ml seems to be a computer tech themed instance that doesn't have so many people, so there's not so much to overload all the circuitry bits.

This is the kind of thing that made me choose this instance in the first place. Thanks for making my online social place of choice feel safe.

I'm still grasping the concept of the fediverse, but what is the perk to this? The Facebook mafia can't comment and join communities on lemmy.ml? But they could on say lemmy.world?
- That's correct. And you as a user of lemmy.ml, when you set your feed to 'ALL' it won't show posts or communities from those instances. But if your account is on lemmy.world, you would see them. You can also personally block any community you want. I don't think you can block certain instances on a personal level, could be wrong though.

Good.

Reasonable and wise.

I’m out of the loop what is going on?

Meta is launching a Twitter clone that's supposedly going to be fediverse-compatible eventually. Everyone's panicking now and blocking the domain before it can connect to any instances because zuck sucks

Good Anakin, goood!

Awesome. This is great news. I just joined this instance and happy to see this position.

I agree with this, cut off the sick limp before the infection spreads.

The fact that limb got changed to limp was a nice touch. I probably shouldn't laugh at the idea of people having legs amputated...
- Just like threads became threats in the title.

My support to this decision.

Is it possible for meta/threads not to read lemmy.ml posts as well?

Meta could fetch posts, but only read them. Meta won't be able to follow our communities or interact with us.
- Good stuff! I definitely chose the right place to make an account.
- That's fantastic news. So they will have their own bubble, and view our nice gardens.
  
  Thanks for the reply.
- Meta could fetch posts
  
  I'm sure a firewall rule or two could sort that out right quick
- I don't even think it's possible. Made a profile on Threads just to see if this was possible but I can't seem to find a way to connect it to the fediverse

Burning threads? The Dragon Riders of Pern approve.

Dragon riders will fly when threads are in the sky

Good riddance.

How does it even work though? I haven't seen any Mastodon or other fediverse posts on Lemmy. What sub would the Threads posts appear in?

Threads themselves have not federated yet, but the threat is that they could at some point in the future. So, you will not see posts from Threads on any instance right now
- Threads still hasn't implemented the ActivityPub protcol yet but I think it could happen any week or month now. The best course of action is a preemptive block.
It's interesting because I have not seen anything federate from my Mastodon instance to my Lemmy one. I have seen things federate from my Lemmy one to my Mastodon one. Maybe some of the implementation of ActivityPub is still being worked out?

Is it me or he looks like Queen Elizabeth

Great move from lemmy.ml, now I hope other instances follows

God I can’t wait to stop seeing his face, so much of it lately

Can someone eli5 what’s going on with this?

meta is trash and we don’t want its data getting all snuggly with ours. because ew.

now you’re up to speed.

edit: data privacy concerns are the main issue
- If Meta can federate with an instance, it can collect all the available data within that instance. This seems to be what everyone is overlooking on the downsides of Meta federation.
- Our data is already public though? The ActivityPub standard specifies that the majority of data we publish on any given instance is public through that instance's API, and a web scraper could be easily built that would comb through and gather all of it for advertising or machine learning purposes. The only real way to avoid that would be to take the sites themselves private, which would kind of defeat the point of social media, or to just not use social media.
Assumption 1: Meta / Mark Z are objectively untrustworthy

Assumption 2: The Fediverse is a threat to the entire internet advertising machine

Assumption 3: Threads will be a hospitable place for right wing hatemongers. Therefore, federating with it exposes our most vulnerable users and communities to a deluge of (often invisible) hate and harassment.

Assumption 4: Most of the ways that they could use their billions of users and army of programmers to slowly choke us off would go through federation

I think if you believe all four of those assumptions defederation is the clear choice
https://ploum.net/2023-06-23-how-to-kill-decentralised-networks.html

I know we all dream of having all our friends and family on the Fediverse so we can avoid proprietary networks completely. But the Fediverse is not looking for market dominance or profit. The Fediverse is not looking for growth. It is offering a place for freedom. People joining the Fediverse are those looking for freedom. If people are not ready or are not looking for freedom, that’s fine. They have the right to stay on proprietary platforms. We should not force them into the Fediverse. We should not try to include as many people as we can at all cost. We should be honest and ensure people join the Fediverse because they share some of the values behind it.
- Exactly. I don't understand why so many people have this mentality of 'the fediverse must grow, or it's a failure', but I think a lot of them are from the recent reddit exodus (I am too, for the record) and are addicted to the firehose of content that a massive social media platform brings.
  
  I participated less and less on reddit in recent years, after joining in 2007, partly because it became such a behemoth. Nowadays, I am enjoying the modest size of my lemmy instance and the values I've seen espoused throughout. It's like a small(er) get together of like-minded people rather than an open-door rager - the first has always had more appeal to me, personally.
- Well said.
The Zuck is making his own fediverse instance, seems to mostly be a twitter competitor atm.

Admins with good sense are defederating that instance, because we know that they have nothing but bad intentions.

🐐

Good thing, i don't want anything to do with Meta's crap either. If someone is complaining he can always do an account somewhere else.

noice

Serious question:

Is he sick? That he has no facial features whatsoever?

He looks like a skinwalker lol

Permanently Deleted

Thank you!

Bravo!

Have they even implemented ActivityPub yet? I have a feeling they won't actually go through with it anyway.

Every one of their press releases has fediverse integration as a major selling point. Whether they go through with it or not, we should be ready to take them at their word.
- major selling point
  
  That's why I think it won't happen. Now that everyone's been "sold" on it, there's no incentive for them to actually do it. But they got the fediverse talking about them ad nauseam right now, which I think is exactly what they want.

Very good! I sincerely hope all the others will too. If lemm.ee won't, I know where I'll be moving to ;)

Lemm.ee has expressed a very hands off approach to defederation and hasn't even defederated exploding-heads
- Oh.. great.. There's one very lukewarm comment the admin made yesterday, but I x-posted the article to the local meta channel with hope they'll make a clear stance on the situation.

Would anybody be surprised if he bled white goo like Ash in the movie Alien. He looks not quite human.

He looks like a nightmare version of that gay sex robot man from A.I.

Awesome.

Lemmy.ml is devil they said. Who ? Capitalist's Nazis fasicts

That’s the way to go

thank you.

Great news! 👏👏👏 Hope other instances do the same.

Good

threats

Appropriate Freudian slip

Excellent move. Hope bluesky is next.

@dessalines cool!

Permanently Deleted

A welcome move. F**k megacorps polluting everything on internet.

Meta is a dying company. Let's help they follow their natural course to oblivion

They really want their tendrils in everything, don't they?

Thank you for taking a stance!

Its Nice to hear

I am a little new to this. What do you mean by not letting them in, or blocking them? Not allowing them to create a "lemmy.threads" instance or something like that?

Threads will support the same protocol as Lemmy (which is called ActivityHub), meaning Thread-content is accessible in Lemmy (and other services) and the other way around.

By blocking Threads no content from there will arrive here and the other way around.
- Thank you for the clarification.

Yes, thank you, I was anxiously looking forward to this.

Completely support .ml defederating. But most Twitter/Reddit exiles want/need a bigger network for the breadth and depth of content they got from those sites. Universal defederation does nothing but hand those users (and their data) to Meta.

I want to get Meta's data without giving them my data. If there are no instances that allow me to do that, I will cry.

"Most twitter/reddit exiles want/need..." Nope. You don't speak for me, I like it here.

"...Does nothing but hand those users (and their data) to Meta" OK? That's their choice to leave then, who cares?
- Do you understand what the word "most" means?
But most Twitter/Reddit exiles want/need a bigger network for the breadth and depth of content they got from those sites. Universal defederation does nothing but hand those users (and their data) to Meta.

And? If they want to run from one corporate overlord to another that's their own prerogative. Most people here are here because they've had it with corporations fucking them. The people here don't need to compromise their worldview for the people who are either indifferent or opposing of their worldview.

I want to get Meta’s data without giving them my data. If there are no instances that allow me to do that, I will cry.

If you care so deeply about it there's a fairly simple solution, make your own instance of Lemmy and don't defederate Threads. If you feel like others also need to have that option make your instance open.
- You're telling me to make my own instance because you want all instances to defederate?
  
  Make it make sense.

That is great news!

Thank you!

So what’s this mean, no one can post links to threads or meta content?

Thanks 👏

Cool.

👏

“Sad dial up noises”

Would anything change on Lemmy, even if you federate with Threads?

You follow communities here on Lemmy, while on Threads you follow people. The only way for a Lemmy user to find a Threads user, would be looking for their username directly in the search bar.

In that sense, what does a Lemmy instance gain from defederating with Meta?

I think it's more that users and administrators don't trust Meta, and for good reason. They're driven by profit and have demonstrated repeatedly a blatant disregard for users. They have virtually unlimited resources at their disposal that could be used to potentially harm the fediverse in a number of ways.
Honestly I am confused by this too. If you don't federate with threads doesn't that just make it easier to grow? Personally I am more curious about Mastodon now because if people I follow on twitter move to threads I can just use mastodon and not twitter or threads...
- In my personal opinion, Lemmy should be more focused on content rather than RAPID growth.
  
  Growth is usually related to corporations mindset, which is a "for-profit" mindset, and unfortunately, as we seen in the past it, it comes with "by all means" attitude, results in manipulating users, make users addicted, and more actions at the expense of the users.
  
  You'll see that when Lemmy will pile up more content, the community will naturally grow in a healthy manner.
Nothing, it's the same virtue signalling I was sick of seeing on Reddit and it's people celebrating taking away the choice from other users.

These nonstop threads posts has soured my Lemmy experience after a month of being extremely active here.
- Read up on the EEE business strategy. Read up on Cambridge analytica, on the numerous controversies surrounding Facebook enabling extremism.
  
  Corporate power, and especially not this corporation, should not be welcome in the fediverse at large. We have nothing to gain by welcoming them. Facebook is the only one who wins.
  
  And for your last point of mean admins taking your user choice away, this is the fediverse. I’d you don’t like it, make your own instance for corporate bootlickers and federate with them all you want
- At this stage it is only virtue signalling - the signal is that the larger lemmy community has no interest in interacting or co-operating with Facebook or other large anti-privacy organisations. It's that simple. You can always join a different server with different values, nobody has taken choice away from you.

Whenever I see Zuck I think of this song "Is Mark Zuckerberg a Ghost" by Nap Eyes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gq2YhOY55zU

Also, this is the right move. Facebook/Meta only wants to harvest our data and profit off it.

whats the threat here huh?

Nicely done!

NICE

For the purposes of discussion, can someone eli5 me on the pros and cons of federating with threads?

A big corporation has the opportunity to tweak things without sharing, offering unique benefits for people of their server, slowly sucking up all the users. Then suddenly there is no federation, as everyone wants the unique features.

Think about web browser and chromium. Google pretty much dictates the core features of the internet now a days.

I may me way off base to be honest, just my 2 cents
- expired
- Nah, you're spot on. Let's keep this simple and not muddy the waters. If it's corporate, it's evil. All you need for a rule of thumb. There may be rare instances when this isn't the case, but I've yet to see one that lasted for long. Let's be real here, corporation's raison d'être is increasing shareholder value and dividends - inherently and inevitably incompatible with the common good.

So you need to put threads.net on you defederation list?

That's already done.

Permanently Deleted

so like if i want to read threads.net can i like say i want to read it still? how would that work, like can i just bypass your ban decision you made for me or would i need an account on another server that has not banned threads.net?

@Maebbie @dessalines

Make an account on threads.net, maybe?
- Maybe he's not a full on idiot but just idiot curious.
- i dont want to have an account there, just be able to (easily) read whats there or is it wrong that its the same protocol?

based

This is good news that lemmy.ml has blocked threads though I have recently seen a tankie instance show up I assume we will defederate from them as well?

You all can't catch a break can you?

Permanently Deleted

might be okay. trust people to filter them from feeds unless blatant exploitation spam. then bye bye any improvements they might offer is probably open sourced through use of fedi libs. devs copy code all the time

To be honest, I dont think this is that good of an idea. We need to stop talking about profile, but focus on the content in it. People like me could be able to follow friends and family over on threads, which could help in terms of user lock in.

Blocking them could be good idea if lemmy was big enough to compete.

Why can't people vote for this?

What are the odds meta doesn't make a ton of accounts to vote their way? Defederating meta/threads is not something that needs to be voted on when we know exactly what they will do to activitypub given the chance
- I completely disagree that its not something worth voting, but I already seem to be in a minority ( or less vocal opinion), so...
You can spin up your own instance or go to one of the servers that did choose to stay federated to threads.

Can anyone point out any servers who aren't federating for folks who want threads?

Just make a Threads account.

Can you change which lemmy server your account is on, or do i just need to make a new account on a server that doesnt ban anything? Does anyone have a recommendation on a server that allows all conversation, uninhibited?

You could try making an account on Threads.
Yes try. Threads, a new service from your friends at Facebook.
- Lmao
The admins of lemmy.world are generally opposed to defederating and have apparently announced via mastodon (i haven't seen the official post but several comments have said) that they will wait and see what threads federation looks like before deciding whether or not to defederate.

Incredibly stupid. Tinfoil hat shit.

if only...
Why do you think that?
- ActivityPub gets mass adopted by a huge social network and everyones reaction is to scream and cry that the sky is falling. Same few links keep getting spammed (EEE, fedipact). All the elements of a reddit circlejerk like the Net Neutrality shit that had 0 effect on anything. Anyone saying otherwise gets downvoted.
  
  I love reddit!

Very Rare Lemmy W

I don’t understand this logic. Don’t we want Lemmy to be more mainstream and user friendly? Preemptively blocking any mainstream attempt to connect and bring in more users just sounds slightly petulant to me. Like I get meta = shitty company but I don’t get why we shouldn’t encourage more people joining the fediverse. And getting external help in growing it. And threads was the first mainstream olive branch that showed Lemmy, Kbin, and mastodon has legitimacy worth building infrastructure to join.

Idk blocking other people categorically from connecting just seems antithetical to the idea that it should be a decentralized system free to all to join.

But I’m new here, so maybe Im mistaken on the ethos of Lemmy.

Permanently Deleted
- This is an excellent read on the idea.
  
  https://extranewsfeed.com/tolerance-is-not-a-moral-precept-1af7007d6376
  
  In a nutshell "Tolerance is not a moral absolute; it is a peace treaty."
- I agree. But not everyone on that app are people who share greedy and hurtful ideas. Thats just extreme generalization imho.
We want new users, but not any random users at any costs.

I'd rather see the community growing slowly but organically than adding a bunch of random people with a toxic Instagram logic.

We don't have to be 10s of millions to enjoy it here either.
Organic growth is good. Growth for the sake of growth makes no sense outside an environment where you need those metrics to convince investors.
- I would also contend that it’s good for creating more content for people to consume. Lemmy desperately needs more content to be able to provide a compelling experience for most people to put up with the cumbersome nature and awkward aspects of the fediverse.

Now block the Genocide-denying, racist, fascists that are from Lemmygrad.ml, the same site the self-proclaimed authoritarian Admins manage

Hi there! Looks like you linked to a Lemmy community using an URL instead of its name, which doesn't work well for people on different instances. Try fixing it like this: !meanwhileongrad@sh.itjust.works

Is Twitter banned as well?

Is it federated?
- Twitter is not federated

preemptively blocking an instance just because it’s owned by meta and not due to bad conduct is cringe as fuck

In what universe are you living in that meta does not have a history chock full of bad conduct?! Frog, meet scorpion.

Oh, and stop misusing "cringe" while you're at it.
- you should watch minority report
- this is not a misuse of the word. this does make me “have an inward feeling of acute embarrassment or awkwardness.” via google and It is “so embarrassing, awkward, etc. as to cause one to cringe” via merriam webster 👍
This platform is built on getting away from large corporate ownership. It would make 0 sense to allow it. Just use another instance if you want/need to see their content.
- Permanently Deleted

Okay but isn’t lemmy.ml the one that’s developed by tankies…I don’t think we should be setting our moral compass so close to theirs, guys…AKA if they think something is right it’s probably wrong…

*lmao didn’t realize I was ON the tankie server, whoops my bad. What I meant to say was tankies gooood.

Lemmy.ml is hosted by the developers of Lemmy; their political views are kinda irrelevant here, I don't think there's a single political party that wants MORE of Metas influence in anything
you’re thinking of lemmygrad.ml.

also, there’s a difference between communists and tankies. it my not seem like a big difference to many, but under real scrutiny, tankies are typically just ultranationalists who use th virtues of communism to praise dictators and autarchs and their actions, whereas those who follow the values of communism and socialism still value things like social equality, workers’ rights, and justice.
- I'm not sure where you draw the line, but you don't have to look too hard to find self-described communists defending the actions of the current Russian government which is very confusing to me. From what I understand, that is a good description of the people who run lemmy.ml, and they have allegedly been deleting comments by users discussing the Ukraine war, so i wouldn't be surprised if this comment is deleted.
Please dont be so preasumptious. Because nazis think it is a good idea to stay hydrated it has to be bad? Please look at the problem and why they decided it and not on the political standpoints.
Here is a post of someone with concrete arguments why federating with meta could be bad: https://sopuli.xyz/comment/879382
I’m relatively new. What evidence is there to support this claim? I got the impression that lemmy.ml was supposed to be FOSS centric.
- I mean, I googled it to be sure before I typed it, so I’m not sure where all these apologists are coming from…