‘We have to blow it up’: can never-Trumpers retake the Republican party?

Which will be the optimal outcome

Don’t do that. Don’t give me hope.

I have to think there's something going on behind the scenes to organize a schism in the GOP, no matter what happens in this election. I think it's unlikely that Liz Cheney and people like her will be able to wrest control of the current Republican party away from the fart sniffers, so they're going to have to split and make a new party.

The outstanding question is "Why haven't they done this already?" Maybe there's just not enough solid support to pull it off ahead of the election, surely because there are a lot of people who are sniffing the farts out of fear, and they don't want to burn that bridge yet.

Pay real close attention after this election. Lindsey Graham is going to show his other face again, and a whole bunch of other politicians will, too. Yes, there needs to be a path to redemption, but that path is going to have to include resignation for the likes of Graham, Vance, McConnell, anyone who supported Trump, then very much didn't, and then supported him again. Such people cannot be entrusted with elected office.

Yeah, that's definitely a possible scenario. I'm just undecided if I should fear that inevitable power vacuum or just grab some popcorn.

The Democratic party will become the new right wing party. The question is whether the Republican party will survive in a new hyper fascist mode, or a real left wing party will pick up the pieces.

My hope is for the latter, but realistically it'll be the former.

The entire Republican base will just vote red all the way down no matter who is in the ballot so I don’t think there is a scenario where the Republican Party ever dissolves. They could run a monkey for state senate in red districts and it would win office.

The Republican party won't go anywhere as long as we have a two party system.

I used to see it that way but now? I doubt it will be that simple. So what if Trump is gone and no other republican leader can fit his shoes? Do they even have to?

Maybe it can be even more beneficial for the republicans to have a dead Trump. They can finally have complete control over his thoughts, his brand, image, his idealogy. With ai technology they can insert a nostalgic idealized version of Trump that he never was. More charismatic, more cohesive, malleable, and eternal. A figure like Jesus, like Mlk, like founding fathers. Who cares the real trump is dead? You can do anything with a base that is so hopelessly lost.

you have to admit, it has been satisfying to watch them eat each other

As long as there is a large concentration of a anti-education, anti-intellectual, and nationalistic brained people in easily gerrymandered areas there will probably always be a conservative party. The GOP has been playing their hateful scared brains like a fiddle for a good four plus decades, and they won't go quietly into the night.

Maybe if we didn't have a poorly planned two party system they'd have far less actual power.

Stop. Don't do that. Don't give me hope.

It really won't be hard. Both sides (the trumpet and the old school) know they need the Republican brand to win. They'll have a primary and then they'll do what they do best: fall in line.

It's really not hard to identify why, but billionaires will spend their life savings convincing people that late stage capitalism and oligarchy work.

Trump is happening because far right republicans realized after Watergate that if they wanted to get away with crimes in the future, that they needed to have news that presents "alternate" facts that are favorable to their narrative or that would at the least muddy the waters. Roger Ailes his plan worked basically.

Without censoring his appearances, Trump comes across as petulant/weak/selfish/stupid/hateful/... Without censoring his history, republican voters would have known that he was a serial scam artist, serial adulterer, ... Basically without that alternate fact media supporting rightwing skullduggery, there would never have been a president Trump.

Imo it's nonsense to claim that Trump getting elected, is happening because voters are angry because of mysterious reasons that no one can figure out, when those voters are so misinformed that they consistently vote against their own interests and believe stupid conspiracy theories that are being pushed to rile them up against the "other". As long as that many people live in an alternate reality based on lies and hate, there is no helping them. So the challenge becomes: how do you bring them out of it and how do you prevent it from happening again in the future.

The new left party that forms in the wake of the Republican implosion will rise out of the growing union movement that is already organizing to address that fundamental problem.

This also applies to much of the left. It’s because the US is an oligarchy and doesn’t have representation that is proportional

Trump happened because large segments of US voters feel disenfranchised and resentful, as they feel they have been left behind and that their lives have been made worse by the policies of the political establishment and experts.

Plus "and their solution is to oppress outgroups so that, in comparison, they have more status."

Oh they fucking know. Say it with me:

Wealth Inequity

I don’t think anyone really hates Jo Millionaire. Jo, the master electrician that lives down the street and employs 5-10 electricians from apprentice to employee-master is a millionaire and contributes positively to their local community. Creating jobs through helping people with their electrical projects, spending in the local economy, etc. And that’s a realistic goal for their apprentices to aspire and work towards.

Unfortunately that’s who republican voters think they’re voting to support.

But they’ve been duped; they’re actually voting to support the Billionaire Aristocrats of the world who pull up the ladder behind them through monetary influence of politics and not paying a damn dime on their ‘income’ (because they’re “borrowing against” their unfathomable hoard).

“They” know why the voters and disenfranchised and that’s their fucking plan—because it keeps them employed and wining and dining fancy with their Aristocrat puppet masters.

I wouldn't mind a new socialist party in the u.s politics.

It'd be great if any of them had a proper ground game for local elections instead of just popping up every 4 years and only hyping a presidential candidate. They look too disorganized to take seriously.

There are vast political differences between elected officials within each of the two main parties. That’s how the nation compensates for the two party system. Change a party from within -it’s absolutely possible and has been done before- instead of pissing and moaning that your little boutique clique “party” isn’t popular.

Even if he loses this election he'll be a kingmaker behind the scenes for the rest of his life. On top of being the default candidate every 4 years until he dies.

We're gonna be deprogramming these people for the rest of our lives.

Are you implying that the assassination attempt(s) might be attempts to save the GOP?

Honestly, they could take over the Libertarian party quite easily. It's not like its current leadership is particularly effective.

Considering the number of republicans who have officially come out in support of Harris, even if it's just to avoid trump, it’s certainly possible.

Are they going to rebuild or they just trying to migrate and take over the Democratic Party?

This is exactly what I think is happening. The result of R destroying itself is somehow turning out to be no political home for progressives and left of them in US politics.

A lot has shifted over time, but the default state of American politics has always been two dominant parties.

That said, I could absolutely see a scenario where an American centrist party forms, still solidly to the right of most Western democracy, but centrist by current local standards, which not only pulls in the non-MAGA Republicans but also moderate Democrats, blue collar Dems from purple states, and once it gains traction and wins a few races, massive support from corporations and lobbies.

They'd win landslide victories over both older parties, especially as progressives and leftists gained greater control of the Democratic party through the flight of the moderates to the new centrist party, which would in turn drive even more establishment Dems to the new party.

They could run on nothing more than "common sense compromise, unity, and moving beyond the partisan squabbling that has plagued the country for decades", and be successful for at least 3 cycles before they even had to really take up any issues in earnest.

The deep South would stay red, the West cost, new York, and Illinois would stay blue, but I could see all of the mid Atlantic, Midwest, plains states, new England, and Southwest going for a viable centrist party.

For a long few years, national level politics would be absolute fucking chaos.

After the dictator dies, there is always a battle of wannabes trying to replace him, a map of regional warlords trying to be the next Grand Cheetoh. Hopefully those regional warlords fall into obscurity and sanity prevails

Not so fast. David Duke was saying the quiet part out loud and he was only a fringe candidate. There’s something else going on here, I don’t know what it is exactly, that makes Trump more marketable.

The only things I can think of is that he has had decades in the public eye, and he’s been presented as smart and successful for most of that time. And bizarrely enough, he reflects a bygone era in America where blue collar union guys had pensions, which were blown away by billionaires like him. And yet, this billionaire known for grift and stiffing his workers, somehow became their champion.

The whole process has opened my eyes to just how much marketing works with a certain demographic.

His kids are probably waiting in the wings expecting to be future candidates.

The Democratic Party will never move left. If our country exists in a recognizable way in four years, we need to put every Republican on trial, let the Dems be the party on the right, and start a new leftist party. Anyone with an R after their name is supporting a traitor to democracy, and is guilty of treason by association.

I might vote for an Eisenhower Republican. 90% tax on the rich to pay for infrastructure and federal work programs? Sign me up.

Wait that far? I'd have said Reagan.

While right vs left is overall a useless idea, overall I wan to move more right than trump who I find too centrist. To each their own.

The current Dem standce on immigration is wild.. not the wall is a weird idea.. no they now say trump is just ineffective in building it.

Republicans: "We absolutely will not allow a single bit of progress on this issue unless you give us a wall"

Democrats; "Fine you can have your wall if it means we can at least fix part of the problem now"

Seems like the wild position here are the assholes demanding a wall in order to allow action. They control the House. We have to change that.

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