Why isn't jerking off more valorized as an easy dopamine hit that's also literally good for you?

I'd like to go a bit deeper.

go on...

Defeat the ruling class... jerk off

this is exactly the truth

Citation needed.

IMO, and without actual data to back it up, I reckon religion (and religious difference) is responsible for the most suffering throughout the history of humankind.

I don't think it's the source. I think it's a tool of social control that enables the powerful to create a bare minimum willingness to be ruled. For a long time the doctrine of Christianity was the Divine Right of Kings. Now it's the Prosperity Gospel. The books did not change but the people with all the money and power ensured the church leaders who served their interest had most of the money and thus followers.

If we didn't have religion, some other social construct would arise, and I'd argue, has arisen to fulfill it's role. Modern economic theory justifies the current power order in an unfalsifiable way that reminds me of religion.

Religion could be a liberatory force in society. In fact it has been. The liberation theology movement in South America and numerous heretical movements in the late medieval period are both examples of progressive Christian social movements.

You can jerk off without porn. Think of all the advertising and subscriptions on porn sites. Those have nothing to do with masturbation and everything to do with capitalism.

Thanks for the response. What you're describing - feeling a bodily urge to masturbate when viewing porn, even if you'd prefer not to - is very common. We're kinda designed so that our bodies respond to sexual stimuli. Many people can relate to that internal tug-of-war between an impulse and a conflicting desire.

From a psychological flexibility perspective, the key is to approach those urges with mindful acceptance rather than struggle against them. Fighting with or trying to suppress an urge often just makes it grow stronger, like a beach ball you keep trying to push underwater - it keeps popping back up with greater force (1). Instead, psychological flexibility invites us to open up and make room for the urge, observing it with curiosity and letting it be fully present in our awareness.

This doesn't mean you have to act on the urge. In fact, by giving it space to exist without resistance, you gain the ability to unhook from it and consciously choose how to respond in line with your values (2). You might say to yourself "I'm having the thought that I need to masturbate right now" and feel the sensations of that urge in your body, while still maintaining the freedom to decide if acting on it is truly what you want.

Imagine for a moment that a dear friend or loved one came to you struggling with this same dilemma. How would you respond to them? Most likely with compassion, understanding, and encouragement to be kind to themselves as they navigate this very human challenge. We could all benefit from extending that same caring response to ourselves.

At the end of the day, you're the expert on your own life and what matters most to you. By practicing acceptance of your inner experiences, unhooking from unhelpful thoughts and urges, and clarifying what you truly value, you can develop psychological flexibility to pursue a rich and meaningful life - whatever that looks like for you. That means that there's no one "right" way to relate to masturbation and porn. The invitation is to approach it mindfully and make choices that align with the kind of person you want to be.

(1) You can check out the "rebound effect" or "ironic process theory." It's been studied extensively in the context of thought suppression. The seminal paper on the topic is Wegner, D. M., Schneider, D. J., Carter, S. R., & White, T. L. (1987). Paradoxical effects of thought suppression. Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 53(1), 5–13. https://doi.org/10.1037/0022-3514.53.1.5

(2) This meta-analysis reviewed laboratory-based studies testing the components of the psychological flexibility model, and how psychological flexibility techniques increase behavioral flexibility. Levin, M. E., Hildebrandt, M. J., Lillis, J., & Hayes, S. C. (2012). The impact of treatment components suggested by the psychological flexibility model: A meta-analysis of laboratory-based component studies. Behavior Therapy, 43(4), 741-756. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.beth.2012.05.003

I've ended up having sex with my marijuana and smoking my semen.. And I can't help but ask myself, where did it all go wrong?

Bro you can't just list basically every human ADL and say it's a "rigid behavior". That's basically like saying "Oh, you claim to like variety? Then how come you spend every day ALIVE?" thats idiotic, arrogant, cynical

I mean that’s definitely just a checkout aisle self-help book, though.

Hayes is not a checkout aisle self-help book lol he pioneered multiple major branches of CBT. that's like calling the Rolling Stones elevator music

I’d generally be pretty skeptical of anything a book like that says about how you have to live your life or what you should be doing or how you should be doing it

I admire the skepticism but you haven't read it and clearly haven't taken time to fully understand it. he isn't making prescriptive claims. he's speaking on behavioral science. "A happens, then B tends to happen. C happens, then D tends to happen. do what you will with this info."

I don’t like the scientific paint that is painted onto psychology and psychotherapy, is I guess what I’m saying.

i understand the apprehension about psychological research but it is fundamentally a subjective science - psychology is what makes subjectivity possible, after all! and we humans clearly need treatment. if everyone listened to the ideas you planted in here, then what would we do? not try any treatments at all? not test our treatments? not seek evidence that our treatments are working and improve them? not share our findings?

the issue fundamentally is that you need to learn more about reading and interpreting scientific literature. you're presenting a pseudo-intellectual skepticism which is admittedly a healthy protective mechanism from many things online, but is not going to be a useful attitude for all kinds of growth

im sorry im being a dick but this thread has funked up my barometer for crazy and i probably misinterpreted your level of it, be well

Goonscrolling is a crazy word for it, and is now what i will be using from now on lmao

Coomscrolling

At least 4-7 times a week. I have not read anything about an upper limit so go for it.

My guess would be the benefit plateaus at that point.

There is the factor of diminishing returns.

Username checks out

I beat my addiction 7 times a week!

How do ya figure?

Seminal. Heehee

Death by snu snu!

Then it's the other way around obviously for more pain and suffering.

You can get a prescription for paid sex in the Netherlands if certain conditions apply, and other EU countries are exploring the option.

I don't know how hot she'd be though.

You shouldn't do that anyway.

If you bring a black light at night, it looks like the surface of the moon in direct sunlight

This mofo walks barefoot on the streets.

"Bustin' makes me feel good!"

So only I can eat them. Mwahahaha!

A lot of the power users in this thread have clearly never heard of "sex sells".

It's powered by there being enough of us wage slaves, which requires us to procreate, which is why red states in the US ban sex education, abortion, etc.

Of course, other capitalists have realized they can show ads on porn

I actually agree. What's addicting is the hit of dopamine from sexual release, not the porn itself. I see porn as more like how people who quit smoking often still find something to fiddle with in their hands and mouth. Biting on pencils, straws, etc. because part of their ritual of using the substance involved taking out a cigarette and putting it up to their mouth. The act of viewing porn itself isn't the addiction, but it's associated with it.

Like I said, moderation is key, because there's a wide difference between masturbating a healthy amount and filling various cumjugs with figurines in them. Like if you can go out and live a normal life after jerking it, awesome, fuck yeah, that's great. If you can't make it through a workday without going to the bathroom to crank it, maybe you've got a fucking problem. I shouldn't have to deal with some fucking weirdo breathing heavily and shaking the whole stall next to me in the bathroom because they can't wait until they get home.

The porn is rather a social knock-on effect because people often seek out porn to make the pathway to dopamine release easier. The seeking of the orgasm has almost nothing to do with the societal implications of porn and its impact on relationships. However, the social impact is that people begin to associate unhealthy aspects of porn with a sex life and achieving orgasm in a sex life.

There are unfortunately deep layers of exploitation, unhealthy power dynamics, and control in porn that can be healthy between consenting adults who have achieved trust but some people really start digesting this porn before they're mature enough to know how to healthily navigate those issues (especially in a society that sure as fuck isn't teaching them, because of the aforementioned religious demonization of sex). This leads to further unhealthy experiences with sex, and I don't think the gay (and LGBTQ+ community as a whole for that matter) community is free from that exploitation or people being exposed to it before they've had to education to navigate it healthily either. In fact, as a minority group, I would rather think they're more likely to be exploited by the same people who hate their very existence... which further ingrains and exacerbates the very problems I'm speaking to, because the exploitation aspect of pornography is normalized. The areas that consume the most LGBT themed porn tend to be the most religiously restricted, and their viewpoint of that porn is almost 100% exploitative. To me it's a hard sell that that's not somehow a net negative for the LGBT community and that they're mostly being exploited in pornograhy and in sex work by the very people who want to demonize their very existence.

I, we all rather, are "addicted" to air, water, food, shelter, safety, rest, etc. - which as you say isn't the same as a true "addiction" at all. Wanting things that produce a healthy life is not a bad thing, and in fact quite the opposite. To the extent that religion or culture or whatever encourages the opposite (rather than e.g. moderation and consideration, like mindfulness), it is wrong and bad. Even for someone who believes in a God who is good, those false beliefs need to be cast aside, bc they hinder us from living well. I wish I had discovered this earlier in life.:-D

called a toilet

I think neither should exist.

Not sure... 🤔

I just remember reading an article about it years ago and even then I was like "Is it the semen, or just the fact they had sex?" lol

I mean addiction colloquially. The existence and over use of porn does cause some people and their relationship some level of affects. I don't think we can just hand wave it all away.

I don't agree, in the experience of my friend circle, if you don't release for a while:

• you start having wet dreams
• prostate harm - increased rates of prostate cancer in multiple studies - and my friend developed pelvic floor issues
• the "mental harm" is having to walk around horny all the time, constantly thinking of sex, and affecting your interactions
• even celibate people mostly masturbate, that's not what it means. Including many confessions from priests

I don't know, I would think that reducing the risk of prostate cancer is necessary. There was a study that demonstrated that men who ejaculate 21+ times per month were over 30% less likely to develop prostate cancer.

Where you circumcized after you became sexually active?

If not, how would you know there is no loss?

I also don't have a moist area for bacteria to multiply

If only you could wash yourself.

• keratinization of the glans
• loss of the gliding sensation between the penis and the foreskin during penetration
• loss of the Meissner corpuscles in the foreskin

About the multiplication of bacteria in a moist area, how do you handle that in your mouth ? Surgery or personal hygiene?

it even helpfully dispenses some lube if you REALLY get into it!

Yeah, not for everyone.

There are anecdotal reports of antisocial behavior, erectile dysfunction, etc in many small communities. I think yourbrainonporn.com is a good primer and rebootnation is a forum with people trying and failing to stop masterbating even to their own detriment. Make your own decision though.

What about this video?

Well, I'd say knowing this can add some stress to it, so it does have some significance in a tiny amount.

Only if you're drinking too much.

Try them at the same time for a combo kill!

I was going mostly off how I've delt with addictive behavours in my life and how casualised therapists like Healthy Gamer explain how dopamine works.

It's also worth noting that this user also posted about lacking motivation to even play video games at this point, which if they're using masterbation as an easy dopamine crutch it could explain where there motivation to do anything else is going.

But yeah, I didn't prepare academic level citations for my lemmy post I made during a lull at work.

The most relevant to this discussion would be around "porn-induced erectile dysfunction". If you Google that phrase, you will find lots of studies and results.

Hmm. We’re having trouble finding that site.

Thank goodness.

I think you want to be right, but you should probably prove yourself right by signing up for a bateworld account and see for yourself. You're probably meaning well, being a happily married, hetero male, and don't want to believe that some of the hetero males you wave to as you drive past them, some of your cousins, or even your favorite co-worker with a wife and five kids, are probably on that web site jerking off to it. *edit: also, the web site has been making money for over 20 years. It's always been chock full of married straight males.

some people aren't, and they like the taboo feel. really, don't try to educate me. I know all about it. Try, instead, to be less blah. We're not talking about "some people" we're talking about men who are really into their penises. Your public service announcement, while making me yawn, also makes me think that you're really not paying attention to what I'm talking about at all! These people I'm talking about are not gay, or questioning, or curious, or obsessed over their sexual orientations. They're heterosexual. Heterosexual men enjoy their own penises. Your "intervention" is kind of stupid and uncalled for here. I'll gladly talk to you about gay rights or whatever, but this is not the place. Biologically, I'm explaining, being a man and having a penis, you basically have an easy target to get some dopamine. We are formed this way. More women might like to chime in on this conversation. Are they getting easy dopamine hits off their clits? Were they raised to do this by their parents? No. Women are still subjected to shaming for sexual pleasure. Men, on the other hand, are encouraged to be aware of their pleasure organs. I really wish I could delete your bullshit comment. It has nothing to do with what I'm talking about.

I bet he's a priest

I am just a social conservative in the Fediverse offering my two cents.

Sorry to coom on your circle jerk on jerking

Yeah I believe there's this weird story about how like... Onani/onanism entered the vocabulary through the Old Testament character and then the notoriously private Japanese adopted the foreign word "onani" to refer to masturb8tion and so it just sticks in my head a bit more and comes out when I feel the need to slightly self-censor in consideration of being on the work net (it's not an English speaking IT team but, you know how it goes, don't be the shortest hanging fruit).

With only a single event, it could be something as boring as what music you listened to during a workout. That can actually have a pretty strong influence, where maturation at best has a small influence, if any. If that weren't the case, the Olympics wouldn't be full of athletes fucking, because releasing their sperm somehow has a negative effect on performance. (If you believe it's only masturbation, not sex, I'm going to need you to consider what mechanism could possibly effect this, because I can't think of any.)